# To or Against Those Who Obstinately Persist in What They Have Determined explained — Discourses

> Chapter companion for Discourses by Epictetus.

## What happens

Epictetus warns against the blind persistence in one's determinations without first ensuring they are sound and rational. He illustrates this with the story of a companion who resolved to starve himself to death for no reason, arguing that firmness is only virtuous when grounded in truth and health, not in madness or folly.

## Themes in this chapter

### Rationality and Self-Examination

Epictetus insists that determinations must be examined for soundness before being adhered to, warning against irrational persistence.

### Desire and Aversion

The chapter illustrates how misguided desire (e.g., to die) and aversion (e.g., to changing one's mind) lead to self-destructive behavior when not guided by reason.

## Character check-ins

### Epictetus

Epictetus confronts a companion who has resolved to starve himself, arguing that determination must be based on sound judgment.

### A companion

A companion of Epictetus resolves to starve himself to death without reason, and is eventually persuaded to change his mind.

## Key lines

> I require tone (sinews) in the body, but such as exists in a healthy body, in an athletic body; but if it is plain to me that you have the tone of a frenzied man and you boast of it, I shall say to you, man, seek the physician: this is not tone, but atony (deficiency in right tone).

I want strength in the body, but only the kind found in a healthy, athletic body. If I see you have the strength of a madman and you brag about it, I'll tell you to see a doctor: that's not strength, it's weakness.

_Epictetus distinguishes between healthy firmness and pathological obstinacy, using the metaphor of bodily tone._

> Will you not make the beginning and lay the foundation in an inquiry whether the determination is sound or not sound, and so then build on it firmness and security?

Shouldn't you first check whether your decision is sound or unsound, and only then build firmness and security on that foundation?

_Epictetus emphasizes the necessity of rational examination before committing to a course of action._

## Links

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